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Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill

Posted by Modris Baum  
Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 01, 2012 08:59PM
us    
During the mid 1990s or so there were rumors of a “new” Zn carbonate at SH. The rumors also had it that the stuff looked something like what’s in the photo (click on the thread title at top).

It IS a carbonate – it dissolves completely with effervescence in HCl.

I don’t think it’s dypingite, which is, in any case, a Mg carbonate and was identified in 1979. If I remember correctly, dypingite forms “tracks”, is fluorescent and has a radial structure. This stuff doesn’t do any of that.

Anyone know what happened with the supposedly “new” Zn carbonate – or what this stuff might be?

Thanks - Modris
avatar Re: Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 01, 2012 09:32PM
us    
Nice photo. Vaguely reminds me of a zeolite mineral. When you say "new", do you mean a new mineral for the species list or a totally new mineral? Gary
Re: Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 01, 2012 09:39PM
us    
Gary,

I think they were saying new to SH. But I'm not sure - I wasn't "in the loop".

Anyway - can't be a zeolite. Fizzed away completely in HCl. Maybe it's just weird calcite ...

Modris
avatar Re: Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 01, 2012 09:50PM
Is it "Mineral F" of Dunn [franklin-sterlinghill.com] ?
Re: Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 01, 2012 10:03PM
It is, indeed, Dunn's "Mineral F". As he explained it to me long ago, he had the mineral described and characterized, and had submitted to the IMA for approval. However, he had some second thoughts about the complete characterization and decided to withdraw it. It would likely have been approved back then, as full structural work was not demanded at the time.

Several years later, John Cianciulli (then curator at the Franklin Mineral Museum) and I worked on the material from an optical and chemical standpoint, and we offered material to John Rakovan for description and eventual IMA submission. However, John was unable to carry it all the way through due to the minute size of the crystals we had. Today, it remains an unnamed phase, awaiting some researcher who is willing and able to tackle it anew.
Re: Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 01, 2012 10:14PM
us    
Hi Tony,

Most fascinating!

Well - if anybody wants to work on it I probably have about 10 samples.

In the mean time, it seems that Mindat already has an entry for UM1986-10-CO:ClHMgMnZn which appears to be the same as "Mineral F" (same formula), so I'll try to post it under that.

Guys - that was really fast and amazing!

Thanks - Modris
Re: Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 01, 2012 10:14PM
us    
Hi Jeff,

Well - it sure sounds like it!

I didn't realize it was in Dunn's monograph - or that he described it it as early as 1986. But that's probably about the right amount of time for the "rumor" to reach me.

Anyway - I do think you have probably nailed it again!

OOPS - I hit the send on my reply to Tony before I hit the send on this. Didn't mean to ignore you Jeff!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/01/2012 10:15PM by Modris Baum.
Re: Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 02, 2012 12:09AM
Modris, you have hit the proverbial point of frustration. Until someone picks up the ID challenge it will remain this way. I think if you collect some of the more prolific mineral deposits (like Franklin,NJ and MSH) you will end up with a sub-collection of unknowns hoping for someone to illumin us further in their identidty.
Steve.
Re: Unid carbonate from Sterling Hill
February 02, 2012 01:27AM
us    
Steve,

Have you been in my garage??? How did you know about those boxes I keep there!

Modris
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