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Interpersonal theft

Posted by Colin Manlove  
Interpersonal theft
May 01, 2008 08:34PM
So far this site seems to have dealt with actual thefts from minerals on show, but I would think that interpersonal theft is just as common. Such thefts are often not so clear cut as burglary. I would like some advice on my own experience of this.

Over three years ago I bid just over $100 for a gel-mounted disk of the rare mineral Morozevicsite from the US eBay site topaz-mineral.expl. I was then emailed by the person I had overbid, suggesting that he could have the validity of the mineral tested, and would send me a 'superb' example of Umohoite in return for agreeing to let him have half of my specimen. There was reason to do this, as the seller was not always accurate and the specimen lacked analytic proof. I was reluctant at first, but eventually did so, as the person exhibited an apparent expertise on rare alkaline minerals and had long sought a piece of Morozevicsite, besides being a member of the International Micromount Society. After the mineral reached this man in Paris, silence fell. When I at length emailed him, I was told that the Umohoite was on its way, and that the testing of the Morozevicsite would take some time. Twice more I heard similar excuses, always in an urbane and learned manner that kept me just persuaded that he was only a dilatory academic. Then came six months when my emails got no reply. No specimen of Umohoite arrived. Then arrived another protest of assiduity, followed by another, longer gap. Then I wrote to him, God knows why, to appeal to his honour as a Frenchman. Another great protestation of honesty and professional integrity. Another gap of about a year followed. Then out of the blue he emailed again, asking to confirm my address so that he could put the Umohoite in the post for me. Needless to say, no Umohoite arrived. About two
months ago I told this man I was by now sure he had stolen the specimen from me.

I understand from others from whom he has also stolen that he follows the same pattern, always stimulating expectation and never delivering, and that this seems to give him pleasure. I would like to do something to stop him, but have no clear idea how to go about this without naming him to the societies to which he belongs. Has anyone any good advice on this?
avatar Re: Interpersonal theft
May 01, 2008 11:25PM
gb    
Send him an email pointing to this thread. Tell him unless it's returned by registered airmail within 7 days you'll have no other option but to name him here.

You will have my support in this.

Jolyon
avatar Re: Interpersonal theft
May 02, 2008 11:30AM
no    
Colin,

can you mail me he's name. I was cheated by a french collector several years ago, now I wonder if it's same man...


Peter

andresen_p (att) hotmail.com
Re: Interpersonal theft
May 02, 2008 12:31PM
I had a similar, but not as extreme experience, several years back. I set up a trade with a prominent acedemic type (or perhaps pseudo-acedemic) via the internet. I sent my specimens (very nice micro pyromorphites from Crittenden Co., Kentucky), after many months and numerous e-mails, I received some low grade marcasitie micros. I felt that the trade was unfairly biased in terms of specimen value/rarity/quality and the time it took to get the swapped for specimens was excessive.

Of couse one takes risks when trading, but for some odd reason I expected better conduct from acedemic/professional types. Moral of the story is that there are untrustworthy dishonest induviduals in all walks of life.
avatar Re: Interpersonal theft
May 02, 2008 02:21PM
no    
Hi all, I have recived mail from Colin Thanks Colin!

It's the same man! He never returned anything for a parcel with 30 samples of gjerdingenite from TL ,some rich samples of hilairite from Bratthagen Norway and beside that around 30 other micros.

He now know my e-mail and since he wil be noticed about this thread, with a mail from Colin, I take as granted I will recive a mail from him too, to compensate for this parcel, if not I will publish his name with a general warning to have any thing to do with him in a week!

Regards,
Peter
avatar Re: Interpersonal theft
May 13, 2008 01:19PM
us    
Let us know how this all turns out? I can't stand this person's behaviour and feel they need to know that, with the internet, they can't hide anymore.
Re: Interpersonal theft
July 21, 2008 04:58PM
What ever happened with this fiasco?? Let us know, please.

~ James
Re: Interpersonal theft
July 21, 2008 10:25PM
Nothing happened: but I did not really expect that it would. I only wanted to put people on their guard about this man, and to suggest that they think very carefully before sending a mineral to any individual they do not know well, even if such an individual makes him- or herself sound like a professional mineralogist.

For myself, while I am sure most collectors have experienced some kind of theft or deception in their time, what stood out in this case was the lingering sadism with which the theft was re-enjoyed.

If Peter Andresen was so minded, there are ways of pursuing M. Vernet a little further - but I still say without much hope of response or redress.
Re: Interpersonal theft
July 22, 2008 06:43PM
at    
Is it R. Vernet, the photographer?
Re: Interpersonal theft
July 22, 2008 09:57PM
No, it's Denis Vernet. He is mentioned at the end of the recent MR (38:5, Sept.-Oct. 2007) article on Bou Azzer, as having helped augment knowledge of BA., and in the same place Robert Vernet is thanked for his photographs, so I suppose the two may be related. Until recently Denis Vernet was on the membership list of the AFM, Association Francaise de Micromineralogie.
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