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Techniques for CollectorsOcean Optics spectrometers

30th Jan 2011 18:53 UTCHenry Barwood

I recently acquired an Ocean Optics HR2000 spectrometer at a very reasonable price. These units have high resolution and excellent dynamic range. They are starting to appear as surplus items from larger labs. As configured, the unit I bought had a range of 468-668nm. I returned it to Ocean Optics and had it reconfigured with an HC-1 grating that extended the range to 200-1100 nm. When I added a UV-NIR optical cable and a matching collimator it made the unit into the equivalent of OO's HR2000-ES at about 1/5 the price. The biggest problem I had was getting the Spectrasuite software to run under Windows 7. I eventually had to get Virtual XP to make the drivers function.

The resolution of the reconfigured unit is below 2 nm, and the light gathering power is excellent. I plan on using it for cathodoluminescence and fluorescence spectroscopy. As it is now, the spectrometer has superb light gathering power and can perform very low light level examination of luminescence.

There are a lot of S2000 and HR2000 spectrometers on the surplus market that can be upgraded at relatively low cost. Anyone interested in mineral spectroscopy should keep an eye out for them.

9th Feb 2011 04:54 UTCJamey Swisher

I couldn't agree more. We got a custom done S2000 + A/D1000 USB setup specifically done up for Gemology. Ours covers 200-850nm currently. Works for what we need it for. SpectraSutie is great but there are a few free alternatives that may run better for you on certain OS'es like DOASIS and SpeckWin32 for example.

10th Feb 2011 02:54 UTCHenry Barwood

Hi Jamey,

I've tried playing with the other software, but I'm afraid that OO has you by the reproductive tissue with their file formats. I will say that I'm really impressed with the capabilities of the spectrometer.

Henry

18th Feb 2011 04:56 UTCJamey Swisher

Not sure what you mean by file formats? I have used both of those softwares on our OO unit without issue, before we purchased SpectraSuite.

Yes, the OO spectrometers are some of the best on the market IMHO. Very sensitive and accurate if calibrated and used properly, of course. Even the older units, like the S2000, and such are amazing units with excellent abilities and can be had used for under $1300 ready to go! There are some older ISA OO card units with light and cuvette holder and cables and sampling optics going for under $500-$600 a set typically, if you have an older PC with an ISA slot available you could get started extremely cheaply!!

There is also the GemSpec GL spectrometer, a little less sensitive but an excellent unit for the money I think. Light source is excellent for gemstones and an all in one setup but a bit limited in nm range. But it comes with an excellent database too.

http://www.cigem.ca/research-technology/gl-gem-spectrometer

18th Feb 2011 17:29 UTCHenry Barwood

Hi Jamey,

I would not recommend anyone get a card based spectrometer like the S2000. They are excellent units, but have limited adaptability to newer computers. The USB versions are more flexible. FYI, my total investment in the HR2000 (upgraded to the same as the HR4000-ES) was under $1200. Since Tucson, I've been bogged down a bit and have not been able to set up some of my FL and CL spectrography, but it will be coming soon. I'll keep you posted.

28th Feb 2011 04:49 UTCBart Cannon

I interfaced an Ocean Optics USB 2000 UV-VIS-NIR spectrophotometer into my electron probe five years ago.

I made a hot-melt glue vacuum feed through and an alignment jig for the OO probe fiber which I twisted into place very near the electron spot.

Paul Schlicta of Crystal Research, and I were working on PET SCAN scintillator performance.

I can get a cathodluminescence (CL) spectrum from a 5 micron illumination area. This created a stir at the last GSA meeting here in Seattle.

I haven't learned how to use the OO for absorption spectra of transparent minerals yet, though I have had phone instructions from the GIA's former spectroscopy expert, Shane Elen. He has recently moved back to the Seattle area.

You can see a cathodoluminscene spectrum from one of Drake and Weill's REE probe standards at

http://www.cannonmicroprobe.com/Methods_Services.htm

28th Feb 2011 10:51 UTCJolyon Ralph Founder

Absorption spectra can be calculated simply from transmission spectra

A = log10 ( 1/ T)

where T is the transmission value from 0 to 1

I've been doing quite a lot of work taking the files in from USB Spectrometers for another project recently. If you're doing work with minerals or gems using a USB spectrometer please get in touch with me and I can discuss some of these things offline.

Jolyon

28th Feb 2011 20:24 UTCHenry Barwood

Hi Bart,

Sounds outstanding. I would love to have that kind of spacial resolution. I use a Luminoscope for my CL work, and I'm working on narrowband filtered UV sources (to eliminate Hg lines) for fluorescence work. Perhaps some time in the future laser or LED sources will be inexpensive enough to replace the Hg lamps.

1st Mar 2011 02:02 UTCBart Cannon

Jolyon,

Thanks for your offer, but my OO USB module is temporarily out of my lab so I will need to wait to take you up on your kind offer.

You might want to correspond with Shane Elen since you guys are working on similar pursuits.

10th Mar 2011 19:35 UTCJamey Swisher

Henry Barwood Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Hi Jamey,

>

> I would not recommend anyone get a card based

> spectrometer like the S2000. They are excellent

> units, but have limited adaptability to newer

> computers. The USB versions are more flexible.

These units are as flexible as the newer ones as far as PCs go if you use an A/D converter with USB. Our unit is USB and is an S2000 + ADC-1000 USB, identical to an HR4000 in specifications and abilities IIRC.

10th Mar 2011 20:12 UTCJolyon Ralph Founder

I think I threw out my last PC with an ISA slot about 5 years ago :)

I'd also agree that it's a bit of a false economy - it's unlikely to work with modern operating systems and it's unlikely to have decent support and drivers.

The new unit supplied by the Canadian Institute of Gemmology is apparently very good value, and equivalent if not better quality than the OO unit, at around $1500 - http://www.cigem.ca/research-technology/gl-gem-spectrometer

26th Mar 2011 05:38 UTCJamey Swisher

That unit is quite nice, but not even remotely close to being better then the OO units nor even equivalent, sorry. The OO units are far more sensitive for starters. It all depends on what you want to do with them, for most folks the CIG one would be fine and perfect, for others it would not quite cut it, all depends if a power user or not. Not much out there is better then the OO units when combined with the SpectraSuite software really. I really like his unit he developed for CIG, but it will not do some of the things my OO unit can, and I need those, but if not for that I may have picked one up. But for most users this unit should be just fine. But so would a used unit @ 50% or more less then the price too. ;). All depends what you want. Some don't mind used working units and some have to have brand new, I could care less which personally, I just want the best bang for the buck but won't sacrifice quality for it. But I like the CIG unit enough I did a big release for him on my website, lol. ;).

Joylon, there is NO doubts about the OO units working with current operating systems and such. And it has just fine drivers and support actually. Our works just fine with WIN98, WINXP, WIN Vista 64bit, and Win7 64bit, I have tested it on them. Works no different with the SpectraSuite software then the brand new current units do. The one we have is actually better then the newer ones, but it has also been setup specifically for gemology too. OceanOptics has one of the best support systems around. They helped me with ours and we didn't even buy it from them nor did it still have a warranty on it, lol! If it is USB or can be hooked up to one of the converter cards to become USB, it will work as well, and even better then some, as the newer units and will work on just about any older and current OS.

Worst case scenario for an ISA one that may not work with your OS, simply use a Virtual Machine and install WIN98 or something, and it will work just fine then. There are always ways around things. ;).

26th Mar 2011 07:08 UTCBob Rock

But have you or anyone done any actual side by side scientific test of the two spectrometers for gem use. It is hard to reach any conclusion just on opinions.

28th Mar 2011 05:19 UTCJamey Swisher

What two spectrometers? If you are talking OO and the CIG, it has been done. Also, one can just look at the specifications and see the difference as well. There is a reason one costs over 2x as much. I am not downing the CIG unit, don't think that, I think it is a phenomenal unit at an amazing price. But as is it only covers 400nm-950nm, where as the OO units can cover 200-850nm or 350-1100nm. CIG is 14bit vs 16bit on the OO. The OO are set up with a bit better 25 slit vs the 50 on the CIG, the 25 slit allows for much better spectral resolution. They both use the same CCD though. The older units, well certain ones like we got, actually have a better sensor then the newer ones in reality. Hence why they are sought for intricate work, when set up properly. Then add in the SpectraSutie software with the OO and it really jumps ahead in abilities offering color grading and all sorts of extras, not sure if the software can be used with other brand units or not, if it can may negate a few things. Both units will do the job most folks need. The one nice thing with the CIG unit is that it comes with a database, very very helpful and useful! And it comes with the simple built in light source, but it limits the usability of it down to 400-950nm I believe, where the unit can cover 300-1100nm with a proper light source.

Is one better then the other? Yes. Can both units get the job done? Heck yeah. If I were buying a new unit, would I buy an OO or CIG? It would all depend on if the SpectraSuite software works with the CIG or not, if it does, the CIG unit would be my purchase, if not, not so sure. Between any of the units vs. a good priced used unit? I will take the used unit any day, money in pocket is money that can be spent on other "toys" or specimens, lol. I'm a frugal shopper.

4th Feb 2012 07:25 UTCPavel

I whant to work with old spectrometr files on new PC, but i miss CD jacket with instlation password, plz tell me how i can restore it?

17th Feb 2012 23:08 UTCHenry Barwood

The OO software is available to download, but the password has to be purchased from Ocean Optics. If you have a record of purchasing the unit/software previously from them, you may be able to get them to send you a new PW.

18th May 2015 06:17 UTCWayne Robey

Henry Barwood Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I recently acquired an Ocean Optics HR2000

> spectrometer at a very reasonable price. The biggest

> problem I had was getting the Spectrasuite

> software to run under Windows 7. I eventually had

> to get Virtual XP to make the drivers function.

But from the OO website, to install the software : Enter your unique

28-digit product key. This key was provided at time of purchase via

email and can be found on your order acknowledgement.

How do you get around that?

18th May 2015 14:20 UTCHenry Barwood

The fellow I purchased the used unit from sent me the old key to use.

19th May 2015 06:05 UTCWayne Robey

Is it fair for a code to be submitted so people who buy from a surplus dealer can use it? I don't think the code has anything to do with the specific instrument.

19th May 2015 09:29 UTCJolyon Ralph Founder

if the dealer sold you an OO unit without the key for the software then it was sold incomplete and you will either have to get the original key from the dealer who supplied it or purchase a new key direct from OO.

19th May 2015 13:18 UTCHenry Barwood

The code is specific to the instrument. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad, Spectra Suite has been obsoleted by OO. What you get with an older instrument is the older version of the software. If you want more functionality, you purchase an upgrade (what I did). There are thousands of older spectrometers out there and they would be absolutely useless without the drivers.

20th May 2015 11:21 UTCAxel Emmermann

Hi Henry,

I just bought the latest OO-model, the "FLAME". It still works with the Spectrasuite software but you 're far better off with the latest "OceanView" software. Spectrasuite creates some troubles depending your OS. You have either WIN7 32-bit or 64-bit.

The 32-bit Spectrasuite doesn't work on a 64-bit computer. Even if you let Windows find and solve compatebility issues it won't work.

Now, spectrasuite was pretty much "software belongs to machine". You could casually install it on any computer that you like, as long as it has the compatible OS for the software and you type in the right key.

Not so with OCeanView. You still have to get the right version for your computer (it's download only, so if you have a 32-bit AND a 64-bit computer you possibly MIGHT download both and install them on your two computers... You'd have to check that first!). They send you the key by e-mail upon shipping.

You get a licence for 2 computers. If you want to sell your spectrometer you can sell the software with it PROVIDED that you deactivate it first on both your computers. I'm not sure of the legal issues...

If I start my Spectrasuite up, it recognizes my FLAME as a USB-2000.

I also tried to make my Mightex spectrometer to run with Spectrasuite but that didn't fly.

Once you get the hang of OceanView, it's slightly different than "run of the mill" spec-soft, you get things done.

Axel

20th May 2015 13:37 UTCHenry Barwood

Hi Axel,

Ocean Optics makes really good instruments, not so much software. The problem is that there are no open source software platforms that support OO instruments, so you are pretty much locked into their drivers, etc.I suspect this is to "urge" people to obsolete the older units and buy new ones. That is really discouraging since even their old board mounted spectrometers are highly sensitive and do excellent data collection.

20th May 2015 23:04 UTCAxel Emmermann

Absolutely true, Henry!

I tested the FLAME yesterday on some cut gems that I have. Would you expect to see the VERY dim fluorescence of amethyst under the 255 nm light of a 20 mA LED-source? The FLAME picked it up flawlessly, integration time of 22 seconds... no problems with shifting dark current, very stable.

I don't understand that if you buy something in the price range of 4000-5000 US$, shouldn't you expect it to work without additional cost?

On the other hand: they do have some low grade software that is free. I think it's called SeaBreeze (as opposed to OceanView??? I think that's intended to sound puny ;-))) . Open source too... something for a tinkerer like you?

Cheers

Axel

20th May 2015 23:21 UTCHenry Barwood

Impressive performance, Axel! I still use SpectraSuite to capture my data and then use other open source programs to extract things like Raman shift. Multi-step, but inexpensive data processing.

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