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Identity HelpWhat does AMMMF stand for?

12th Mar 2018 18:34 UTCHolger Hartmaier 🌟

I recently purchased a specimen with an original label marked "AMMMF". Does anyone recognize this dealer or collector? The actual specimen locality was from the Pea Ridge Mine in Missouri, if that helps at all.

Thanks for your help.

Holger

12th Mar 2018 18:54 UTCKevin Conroy Manager

Is it possible to post a photo of the label, and maybe the specimen? I specialize in Missouri minerals so I may be able to help.

12th Mar 2018 21:27 UTCHolger Hartmaier 🌟

Hi Kevin,

Attached are photos of label and specimen.

Thanks for your help.

Holger

12th Mar 2018 21:37 UTCKen Doxsee

Arizona Mineral and Mining Museum Foundation.

Cheers,

Ken

12th Mar 2018 22:13 UTCHolger Hartmaier 🌟

Thanks Ken!

Regards,

Holger

12th Mar 2018 22:45 UTCKevin Conroy Manager

Yep, Ken nailed it! Also, if you look closely at the brown stuff on the calcite crystals you'll notice these are blebs of either hematite or goethite. This specimen is definitely from Pea Ridge Mine.

12th Mar 2018 23:13 UTCHolger Hartmaier 🌟

Thanks for the confirmation Kevin, I will definitely have a look at it more closely with my 'scope.

Holger

12th Mar 2018 23:34 UTCKevin Conroy Manager

By the way, if you want to know more about the AMMMF see this: https://mineralogicalrecord.com/labels.asp?colid=679

I notice that there isn't an example of a label posted to the page. I'll bet the Mineralogical Record would appreciate a photo of yours. If you're inclined to do so see the info at the bottom of the page.

13th Mar 2018 00:19 UTCHolger Hartmaier 🌟

Hi Kevin,

Thanks for the link. I did try to search the Mineralogical Record database for AMMMF but it didn't come up with anything because it was referenced with its full name, as per the article. Coincidentally, the other specimens I recently acquired were from the Arthur L. Flagg collection, so this meshes well with the AMMMF source as well. I will email a copy of the label to Mineralogical Record for their archives.

Thanks again to everyone for your help.

Regards,

Holger

13th Mar 2018 02:16 UTCDana Slaughter 🌟 Expert

The label is in my handwriting and is almost certainly a piece from the late Ted and Marie Duprey collection of Wyoming, Michigan. I purchased their large collection in Michigan and brought it to Arizona. I donated many specimens to the AMMMF. After the closure of the Arizona Mining and Mineral Museum by then Gov. Brewer, we changed our name to the Flagg Mineral Foundation to honor Arthur L. Flagg.

Please check the specimen for a glued number on the backside--the Duprey collection numbers all started with a capital A. They had several flats of Pea Ridge mine pieces, including a few fine fluorites.

Mr. Flagg's surviving family donated his collection (and a portion of his son Richard's) to the FMF and I was part of a small group of FMF members that drove to Tucson to pick up the collection. See the attached photo that shows the portion of the Flagg collection that I spent countless hours in my garage preparing on behalf of the FMF. Imagine pulling out a killer Butte covellite only to have the next specimen be a conglomerate! It was great fun.

13th Mar 2018 03:24 UTCHolger Hartmaier 🌟

Hi Dana,

It's fantastic for me to connect with someone associated with this specimen! Unfortunately there is no number attached to specimen or on the label. However it is great to get the additional provenance data and the historical background. Thanks for putting in all the long hours on this material and making it available to other collectors.

Cheers,

Holger

13th Mar 2018 04:08 UTCDana Slaughter 🌟 Expert

Hi Holger,

I'm certain that it is a Duprey specimen--the glue used on the numbers wasn't particularly good and some tags came off the specimens. If I remember correctly, Kevin and I discussed the Duprey Pea Ridge mine pieces at least a few years ago and we wondered if they had obtained the specimens from him at some time in the past.

The magnetite is present as dark material on the underside and, as Kevin, pointed out, the reddish material is likely hematite or goethite. To my knowledge, the red coating is nearly always offered as hematite.

The Duprey's had a very large collection that occupied nearly all of their basement. They collected all over the US and Canada and bought specimens wherever they traveled and at major shows. I helped them catalog their collection over a period of about 18 months and usually stopped by once a week to spend 2-3 hours organizing and cataloging the collection. Their collecting stories were a real treat to hear and oftentimes Marie would ferret out specimens as she shared their stories. They treated me to stories of collecting underground with Chink Enders in the Tri-State district and then would pull out pieces from under their stairs that they collected on that trip---still wrapped in late 1960s newspaper! It was a real joy to talk with them as we worked on their collection---one they made available for viewing to countless schoolchildren and scout groups. When Marie passed away unexpectedly, their son contacted me about purchasing the collection as Ted had difficulty being alone in the home. Their son Robert had no interest in the collection and so I flew to Michigan, packed the collection and brought it to Arizona. I thought that I would have stock for 10 years but the stuff sold quickly and every now and then I will get an inquiry from an eBay collector asking if I have additional Duprey specimens available.

The Flagg collection was a real treat. As I unwrapped specimens, I would separate the pieces into a few groups; namely, those that should be included in the permanent FMF collection; those that should be retained for trading purposes; those that would be offered to the general public at our annual show; and those I wished to purchase. I unwrapped one piece and assumed it to be a decent Ilfeld manganite only to learn it was from the Stovall mine in AZ! The Tiger, AZ specimens were examined by the late great Joe Ruiz and he discovered many bobmeyerite specimens that had been boxed for over 50 years before it was finally described in 2013. The collection contained very many rare locality specimens from mines that none of us could recall--especially the lean gold ores from the American West.

Since receipt of the collection, the FMF has displayed Arthur L. Flagg specimens and ephemera at the annual Tucson Show. It was an awesome experience and I'm grateful to the FMF for the opportunity to work on the collection.

I was both surprised and delighted to see your post on mindat today and couldn't wait to get home and respond!

13th Mar 2018 15:04 UTCHolger Hartmaier 🌟

Hi Dana,

I'm a retired geotechnical engineer/engineering geologist. In my early career I worked in mineral exploration in northern Ontario and Quebec. As a result, my collection includes both "mundane" rocks and crystallized mineral specimens. My interest is also in historical mineral specimens and mining, so the history of this piece fits well with the overall theme of my collection. I have to admit that I tend to collect more than process and catalog. If someone were to go into my basement today, there would still be pieces in flats collected in the 1970's and 80's wrapped in likewise dated newspapers. Now that I'm retired, I'm trying to work through this older material. I can relate to your comment too- unwrapping one specimen might yield a world-class cubanite crystal from the Henderson #2 Mine in Quebec and the next, a piece of sandstone from southern Alberta!

Cheers,

Holger

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