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GeneralDoes anyone else think the AMNH displays are lacking?
16th Dec 2014 21:06 UTCGreg Kokolus
My wife and I went to NYC for a getaway and one of the stops was the AMNH to see the mineral wing.
I hate to say this, but the word that comes to mind is "dowdy".
Not only for it's dated appearance, but just in the area of general housekeeping.
There was a Realgar that had started to disintegrate and rain orange powder on the specimens below, missing or burned out R40 bulbs in the highhat lighting, the uv lights being at least half off in the fluorescent display and many more things showing a seeming lack of maintainance.
I am usually prettty good at playing "name that mineral" but my radar was really off when I looked at the displays.
After a point, I came to the realization, that the lighting or lack thereof was to blame.
I understand that certain minerals are light sensitive, but certainly not an entire collection.
I thought that the majority of displays were vastly ill-lit or under-lit.
I saw some remarkable pieces, but certainly not what I would of thought of for a museum of this caliber.
Anyone feel similarly having been there?
16th Dec 2014 21:13 UTCturtledove thrushe
https://www.flickr.com/photos/13796250@N00/377984422
http://www.flickr.com/photos/35237098989@N01/3632889400
http://www.flickr.com/photos/18886124@N00/2232385538
http://www.flickr.com/photos/26305847@N00/2960093800
http://www.flickr.com/photos/26305847@N00/2959254391
If these are all from the same museum it surprises me that the museum curators and administration staff didn't take better care of a particularly light sensitive mineral such as this. I wonder how long these displays of Realgar were there and how long it took for it to decompose and crumble into the current state.
16th Dec 2014 21:52 UTCGreg Kokolus
You are absolutely correct.
Those are pictures of the AMNH Realgar to which I refered.
16th Dec 2014 21:55 UTCJasun D. McAvoy Expert
I still like going there, and I go there often, but only because it is close by. The museum definitely needs some updating and proper upkeep in my opinion...
16th Dec 2014 22:01 UTCGary Weinstein
Gary
16th Dec 2014 22:32 UTCBob Harman
16th Dec 2014 22:33 UTCturtledove thrushe
Let me put this into perspective. In the early 2000's I visited Eastern European countries and also ex-USSR member countries and their museums were better cared for even in the natural sciences departments/wings. This is currently 2014 (almost 2015 now) and to see that kind of decay and decomposition from exhibited specimens in a well known museum in America is beyond disappointing. If museums in former Soviet member countries can take care of their specimens even recovering from the collapse of the Soviet Union can then why can't a well known and better funded museum. I believe also Rock Currier recalled that the AMNH was one of the very few museums that didn't allow him to take pictures without paying a fee so that is another negative strike.
Edit: Wikipedia also has this photo of Realgar decomposed and I believe it is the same display as AMNH:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/Realgar09.jpg
16th Dec 2014 23:05 UTCPaul Siegel 🌟
16th Dec 2014 23:30 UTCturtledove thrushe
17th Dec 2014 01:44 UTCJake Harper Expert
Did you get a chance to examine the giant topaz crystal "touch" specimen on the top of the stairs? Brought out by Allen Caplan in the 1930's, it features a beautiful modified pyramidal termination and is lit at the base allowing the viewer to closely examine its limpid translucency including wispy veils and other beautiful internal details. That one crystal makes my trips to the AMNH worth it every time.
Jake
17th Dec 2014 02:06 UTCKeith Compton 🌟 Manager
Perhaps these messages should be forwarded to the curator of the museum to be actioned upon.
Afterall, it would not take much time, effort or cost for that matter to either replace the specimen, or slightly change the exhibit. Perhaps someone just needs to go to the "storeroom" for a replacement !!
Cheers
Keith
17th Dec 2014 02:55 UTCAlfredo Petrov Manager
17th Dec 2014 03:44 UTCJake Harper Expert
http://www.mindat.org/photo-646122.html
17th Dec 2014 03:58 UTCPaul Brandes 🌟 Manager
17th Dec 2014 05:55 UTCJohn Magnasco Manager
AMNH faqs financial data
17th Dec 2014 06:22 UTCRock Currier Expert
17th Dec 2014 06:32 UTCD Mike Reinke
I appreciate both your comments, especially the first one. That topaz was/is mind blowing! I was there the first and only time , and that is what I remember. The gigantic stibnite too; Was almost scary to see they get that big. I don't remember the yellow stain.
But I have been to 2 other museums' mineral displays that had a noticeable number of their lights turned off. Most disappointing, part of the Albert Chapman collection in Sydney! I went to the reception desk when done, commended them on how fantastic it was but asked whether it was an oversight that the lights were not on in part of one room.
Electricity is expensive, but at least have the lights set to a motion detector, to lite up when people are near that display, c'mon!
Mike
17th Dec 2014 06:38 UTCJohn Sobolewski 🌟 Expert
causing bright spots between specimens and leaving the specimens in the shadows. John S.
17th Dec 2014 07:04 UTCChristopher O'Neill
And of course their large highlighted displays such as the Topaz, Jade, giant Bisbee Malachite/Azurite etc.
Nearly all of those systematic or reference specimens are no longer available for public display. I heard you can put in a request to somehow privately view these specimens, but most folks don't even know they exist.
As a NYC boy, the AMNH was once a place where I would venture to explore whenever I got the chance - and now I wouldn't bother at all. I almost don't regret chipping off (OK, I was 10 or 11 or 12 years old) pieces of the Cape York "Ahnighito" meteorites, brought back from Greenland by Peary in 1897 - we used dimes to pry off small chunks. Still got em......
I understand that the museum has to "change with the times" and is restrained with expenses and space, but what is on display now is but a shadow of what once was available to the public
17th Dec 2014 07:05 UTCOlivier Mével Expert
School of Mines, Jussieu gallery (ex-Sorbonne)..
AND the gallery in NHM Paris is reopening in 2 DAYS !!!! after years of renovation ...
"Opening of the exhibition "Treasures of the Earth" December 19, 2014.
During a stroll in the Jardin des Plantes, your steps will lead you to the Gallery of Mineralogy and Geology along the driveway Haüy. Behind the splendor of the roses garden, this neoclassical building 187 meters long, enhanced by two columned porticos, long closed for renovation, is now opening with the "room of Giant Crystals" to host the exhibition "Treasures of the Earth".
Come to France !!!
Olivier
17th Dec 2014 08:48 UTCAlfredo Petrov Manager
I visited one museum where the mineral shelves (frosted glass) were backlit from below!!!! So the viewers' eyes are just overwhelmed by all the light coming up from the spaces between the minerals, and the top of the mineral specimens themselves, which is what I'm trying to look at, is hidden in shadow, lost in the glare. Apparently no one gets fired for these atrocities. The board of directors is happy that their display now looks avant-garde, and they think that's what the public wants to see - avant garde displays. Or more likely the bloody interior decorator they hired was a nephew of one of the board members. Welcome to the real world. But don't blame the poor curator - He had nothing to do with it.
17th Dec 2014 11:10 UTCJohn R. Montgomery 🌟 Expert
Thanks in advance
John
17th Dec 2014 11:25 UTCRoy Starkey 🌟 Expert
I presented a poster at the Mineralogy and Museums Conference in Dresden in 2012 (see image) which aimed to kindle an international debate and some action on this general theme. There was much support from delegates, but this was really a case of "preaching to the converted" - we all need to do whatever we can to encourage more thought in the design of museum displays. It is inappropriate that design practitioners should be able to over-rule the subject specialists, but we see examples everywhere.
Another recent, and very sad example is the "improvement" of the previously excellent displays at the Killhope Lead Mining Museum in Northern England, which are now reduced to little more than a "sideshow", whereas previously they were strong on educational content and factually accurate - sadly no longer the case. To quote the press release issued at the time "The change really is dramatic and anyone who has visited Killhope before will be amazed at the difference." See http://www.killhope.org.uk/Pages/killhopeshowpressrelease.aspx?PID=1bvA4H50CHs=
17th Dec 2014 13:17 UTCRudy Bolona Expert
17th Dec 2014 13:35 UTCMichael Croxell
17th Dec 2014 14:45 UTCHarold Moritz 🌟 Expert
17th Dec 2014 15:12 UTCKelly Nash 🌟 Expert
The Dallas museum has a state-of-art lighting and many large, stunning, specimens ("eye candy"). The LED spots are "tuned" to wavelengths designed to maximize the appeal of each specimen. When I last visited during the Mineral Collecting Symposium, one of the consultants to the museum called it "perhaps the greatest luxury mineral collection in the U.S., and possibly the world". That's their niche, and part of the trend of treating minerals like art objects.
17th Dec 2014 15:20 UTCVandall Thomas King Manager
17th Dec 2014 16:31 UTCSpencer Ivan Mather
Spencer..
17th Dec 2014 16:31 UTCUwe Ludwig
However we saw a relatively big Proustit-specimen of our region coming from Lauta near Marienberg. This specimen was probably a wonderfull one in the past. But this specimen was situated near a window to the south looking as a piece of coal now. We all had tears in our eyes when we left. Besides that we recognised that some of the specimens of our region had no correct locations on their labels.
Rgds
Uwe Ludwig
17th Dec 2014 16:43 UTCTony Nikischer 🌟 Manager
Growing up in New York, I was a frequent visitor to the minerals section, and it was there that David Seaman (a science assistant at the AMNH in the 1960s) showed this little kid the effects of HCl on calcite vs. dolomite vs, aragonite as we tried to identify an unknown I had brought in. Imagine: a museum employee willingly handling acid with a little kid present in a side room at the museum! Impossible today, certainly, but an unforgettable learning experience for me. I have a warm spot in my heart for the AMNH, despite its perceived shortcomings.
Yes, the old displays showed lots of uncommon minerals in rather spectacular specimens, but in defense of the "new" arrangement executed years ago, it was a dramatic visual improvement. Let's hope there is the will and energy to cut through the red tape to spruce up the displays.
17th Dec 2014 17:19 UTCUwe Kolitsch Manager
Now such an argument is just tragic...
17th Dec 2014 17:39 UTCFred E. Davis
17th Dec 2014 19:50 UTCGeorge Harlow
We are very much aware of the deficiencies that have been raised in this forum about the Guggenheim Hall of Minerals and Morgan Hall of Gems at the AMNH. As scientific staff, we have very limited influence over exhibition issues, even if related to display of specimens in our collection in the 38 year old halls. Keeping all the halogen lamps on in all the exhibition cases in these Halls, which have more lamps than anywhere else in the institution, is a never ending challenge. We have begun replacing the MR16 halogen bulbs with LEDs, but it is slow going as there is no budget to do this. As for the diseased realgar in the systematic mineralogy area, I can report that yesterday (16DEC14) we completed removal of the realgar and its pararealgar offspring and installation of an un-diseased specimen after having replaced the lighting with UV-free LEDs. Other significant problems probably await a renovation or replacement of the Halls, which actually is a topic under consideration.
17th Dec 2014 20:07 UTCRudy Bolona Expert
17th Dec 2014 20:56 UTCDana Morong
Another interesting thing about this library is that they don't maintain the photocopy machines, and one may go for months making big smudge marks all over the pages. I have heard that they have to get specialists to come in for that (I was using one once, and met the specialists, and showed the specialists how to do something that some librarian had shown me how, but this was new to these specialists). A couple years ago the payment system didn't work, so for a few weeks they made it free. However, when they put the machines back to regular payment (you have to have a copy card), there is one they forgot, so when the others won't make decent copies, I go to the machine they forgot (which usually works fine), and use the card (last time it had only 5c on it and made a few copies). I think it is quite funny that the one that is free (and which they apparently don't know about) actually works well, and the others don't work well. (they now have a free scanning machine which I think is even better, although with those copies you have to use your machine to read them, they do use less space).
Also, years ago at work, there was some issue about a broken electric receptacle cover (just the common type) in the office part of the building, and someone thought they had to get some specialist to change it, although there are people in the company who work with electrical and electronic devices all the time (the company makes electric testing instruments). I think they did get it fixed. But it shows the mentality of some in bureaucracies that cannot change a light bulb without the bulb also wanting to make the change!
17th Dec 2014 21:44 UTCRoy Starkey 🌟 Expert
With regard to your post above re the "Birmingham Museum natural history department", I would like to add a couple of remarks as a volunteer at the Lapworth Museum and member of the Project Team.
The main Birmingham Museum and Art Gallery collection was loaned to the University in late 2009 (not 2005) and initial Heritage Lottery Fund enquiries / discussions combined with those with the University fund raising team commenced shortly after that. As you may have read in a previous post by myself - see http://www.mindat.org/article.php/2063/New+Earth+Sciences+Museum+for+the+West+Midlands the Lapworth Museum has been successful in its bid to win HLF support for the redevelopment of the museum.
The Lapworth Museum Redevelopment Project is now well advanced and will see the new museum opening in late 2015. As part of this, a completely new mineral gallery will be created. I do not remember the particular stone which you mention, but it is planned for the new gallery to include a good selection of the Birmingham Museum and Art Gallery Gem Collection. I hope you will come along and see the new displays in due course.
Hope that helps and reassures somewhat.
Roy
17th Dec 2014 21:55 UTCStephen Rose Expert
With regard to the disintegrating orpiment and realgar specimens; cleaning the debris from the display cases raises a number of issues, many of which have been mentioned. One other involves the 'hazardous' nature of the mineral itself and all of the regulations that therefore come into play and affect the clean up process.
Cheers, I think,
Steve
17th Dec 2014 22:43 UTCKeith Compton 🌟 Manager
Hooray
Well, it appears the Mindat community has had a small win on the display front.
I say well done to all who participated in this mini forum. Let's hope that more can be done for the minerals at the AMNH.
Cheers
Keith
19th Dec 2014 23:19 UTCturtledove thrushe
-------------------------------------------------------
> The displays of the American Museum of natural
> history are disgraceful, but certainly are not
> uniquely disgraceful. I think of them as
> symptomatic of the general disfunctionality that
> we find in many american institutions like our
> health care system or our government. It reminds
> me of the many jokes about how many people of the
> ethnic persuasion of your choice does it take to
> screw in a light bulb.
Well said and I completely agree. To bring up this point further how can a museum in what is considered a 'developing' country in Eastern Europe or a former Soviet member country be able to maintain proper displays and their infrastructure and a museum in a 'developed' country such as America have such bureaucracy and red-tape that prevents maintenance of displays and their specimens.
22nd Dec 2014 02:18 UTCRock Currier Expert
It would appear that you may not be aware that the cause of realgar decomposition is perhaps not so much UV light as that of visible light 500 to 670 nm range. It would appear that your replacement lights may cause as much damage to your new realgar specimen as your old ones.
http://www.minsocam.org/msa/collectors_corner/arc/realgar.htm
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Copyright © mindat.org and the Hudson Institute of Mineralogy 1993-2024, except where stated. Most political location boundaries are © OpenStreetMap contributors. Mindat.org relies on the contributions of thousands of members and supporters. Founded in 2000 by Jolyon Ralph.
Privacy Policy - Terms & Conditions - Contact Us / DMCA issues - Report a bug/vulnerability Current server date and time: March 28, 2024 23:37:34