Home PageAbout MindatThe Mindat ManualHistory of MindatCopyright StatusWho We AreContact UsAdvertise on Mindat
Donate to MindatCorporate SponsorshipSponsor a PageSponsored PagesMindat AdvertisersAdvertise on Mindat
Learning CenterWhat is a mineral?The most common minerals on earthInformation for EducatorsMindat ArticlesThe ElementsThe Rock H. Currier Digital LibraryGeologic Time
Minerals by PropertiesMinerals by ChemistryAdvanced Locality SearchRandom MineralRandom LocalitySearch by minIDLocalities Near MeSearch ArticlesSearch GlossaryMore Search Options
The Mindat ManualAdd a New PhotoRate PhotosLocality Edit ReportCoordinate Completion ReportAdd Glossary Item
Mining CompaniesStatisticsUsersMineral MuseumsClubs & OrganizationsMineral Shows & EventsThe Mindat DirectoryDevice SettingsThe Mineral Quiz
Photo SearchPhoto GalleriesSearch by ColorNew Photos TodayNew Photos YesterdayMembers' Photo GalleriesPast Photo of the Day GalleryPhotography
╳Discussions
💬 Home🔎 Search📅 LatestGroups
EducationOpen discussion area.Fakes & FraudsOpen discussion area.Field CollectingOpen discussion area.FossilsOpen discussion area.Gems and GemologyOpen discussion area.GeneralOpen discussion area.How to ContributeOpen discussion area.Identity HelpOpen discussion area.Improving Mindat.orgOpen discussion area.LocalitiesOpen discussion area.Lost and Stolen SpecimensOpen discussion area.MarketplaceOpen discussion area.MeteoritesOpen discussion area.Mindat ProductsOpen discussion area.Mineral ExchangesOpen discussion area.Mineral PhotographyOpen discussion area.Mineral ShowsOpen discussion area.Mineralogical ClassificationOpen discussion area.Mineralogy CourseOpen discussion area.MineralsOpen discussion area.Minerals and MuseumsOpen discussion area.PhotosOpen discussion area.Techniques for CollectorsOpen discussion area.The Rock H. Currier Digital LibraryOpen discussion area.UV MineralsOpen discussion area.Recent Images in Discussions
Identity HelpID Help - Lake Asbestos mine (Quebec, CANADA)
10th Jan 2020 18:42 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
Can you help me with this one or maybe a hint? Thank you in advance!
10th Jan 2020 19:11 UTCFrank K. Mazdab 🌟 Manager
10th Jan 2020 21:01 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
10th Jan 2020 21:27 UTCFrank K. Mazdab 🌟 Manager
10th Jan 2020 21:39 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
11th Jan 2020 00:24 UTCFrank K. Mazdab 🌟 Manager
11th Jan 2020 02:31 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
Thanks a lot Frank!
11th Jan 2020 04:34 UTCFrank K. Mazdab 🌟 Manager
"Mg-Fe-orthoamphibole" would include the entire [anthophyllite]-[ferro-anthophyllite] and [gedrite]-[ferro-gedrite] series, but would exclude the possibility of the [tremolite]-[ferro-actinolite] series (these would be "Ca-clinoamphibole", although the "clino" could be considered redundant because there are no calcic orthoamphiboles). "Asbestiform" could be added as a descriptive modifier, which would inform viewers of your specimen that from among all the amphibole species, yours is presumably one of the roughly half-dozen or so known species that has been reported in an asbestiform habit (there are a few others not included in the preceding discussion).
This "what particular species of a complex solid solution is my sample?" issue isn't unique to your specimen, of course. Even just anyone who has common "hornblende" in their mineral collection is faced with a similar dilemma, since "hornblende" is no longer a mineral and the collection of species considered under the "hornblende" umbrella could be any of (or even zoned multiple) compositions representing perhaps a couple dozen species.
In lieu of sending your specimen out to a commercial lab for analysis ($$) or taking it to your local university or museum for analysis (also possible, depending on their willingness to engage in public outreach on such matters), it's also possible collectors from a local club may be able to offer a more definitive ID, based perhaps on their own independently analyzed specimens of essentially identical material (presumably somebody was curious enough to do so). Another possibility is just reviewing the scientific literature on the deposit... it may turn out from the reports that the tremolite/actinolite from there is commonly asbestiform but the anthophyllite never is (or vice versa?). Some of these reports may also contain analytical data, descriptions of assemblages (maybe one species is only found with quartz there while the other is only found with calcite there?), and photos of specimens... all potentially helpful tidbits of information.
11th Jan 2020 17:14 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
Thank you again (sorry, i’m Canadian and so too much grateful!)
11th Jan 2020 19:09 UTCFrank K. Mazdab 🌟 Manager
13th Jan 2020 20:05 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
8th May 2020 15:14 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
After some research on Mindat, do you think I can call it "Byssolite" ?
But Byssolite is not listed there on Mindat...
If the fibers fuses easily and result of magnetic little balls, is it mean that it should include "Fe" in the formula? (the fibers themselves are not magnetic without fusing it)
Thank you in advance!
8th May 2020 22:13 UTCFrank K. Mazdab 🌟 Manager
I suppose your specimen would qualify as "byssolite" and you can add that name to the locality if you'd like (and if your membership level doesn't give you the ability to add minerals to a locality, let me know and I or someone else with the ability can add "byssolite" for you).
But as others here sometimes make a bit of light-hearted fun with me about, I'm not a big fan of varietal names for minerals and tend to prefer to see the names of species and series and such. But this case might be an exception, because while "byssolite" tends to be thought of as typically being part of the tremolite-actinolite series, the name may encompass other pale-colored furry amphiboles as well. And since there was some question earlier as to which particular series your furry amphibole may actually belong to, "byssolite" may indeed be the best choice to cover that ambiguity.
19th May 2020 19:48 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
Are you able to answer my other question, i'm curious:
If the fibers fuses easily and result of magnetic little balls, is it mean that it should include "Fe" in the formula? (the fibers themselves are not magnetic without fusing it)
19th May 2020 20:12 UTCFrank K. Mazdab 🌟 Manager
Pierre-Luc Croteau ✉️
If the fibers fuses easily and result of magnetic little balls, is it mean that it should include "Fe" in the formula? (the fibers themselves are not magnetic without fusing it) yes, that is correct, but I don't know at what minimum Fe concentration along the Mg-dominant to Fe-dominant join that observation begins to hold true, so I don't know if it necessarily helps you to decide whether to add a "ferro-" prefix or not.
(as a fun aside, Ni- and Co-rich compositions might also be expected to fuse into magnetic little balls, but these aren't currently known in nature).
19th May 2020 20:32 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
AX2Z5((Si,Al,Ti)8O22)(OH,F,Cl,O)2
Does it mean, if the result of the fusion is magnetic, that it must include "Fe" in the formula and then, it is not Byssolite?
19th May 2020 22:36 UTCFrank K. Mazdab 🌟 Manager
Just a little background here:
That formula is a general formula covering numerous species, not a specific mineral formula (because "byssolite" is as well not a species, but a varietal name for a diverse group of pale-colored "furry" amphiboles).
So actually, the Fe required for a specific species like actinolite or ferro-anthophyllite is hidden within the "Z". Z isn't a specific element, but an abbreviation for all the ions of similar size that fit into that particular set of sites that all happen to be surrounded by six nearby oxygen atoms. These elements are usually Mg and Fe2+, but Al, Ti, Fe3+, Mn2+, Mn3+, Li and rarer elements can go in there too.
Similarly, the "X" also isn't a specific element either, and instead is a generic symbol representing the slightly larger ions that prefer to have eight oxygens surround them in an amphibole structure. These X elements are commonly Ca and Na, but Mg, Fe2+, Mn2+ and Li can also fit in there. Note the overlap of some elements between the smaller Z site and the slightly larger X site... the elements that show up in both lists sit just on the nominal size boundary where they can occur either in the smaller site alone, or in the smaller site plus with extra slopped over into the slightly larger site. Al is similar in that it can sit in the small silicon site (that's why the general formula shows (Si, Al)), or in the slightly larger Z site. But it's too small to ever occur in the still larger X site.
If you click on the amphibole supergroup link on the byssolite page, you'll get a more detailed overview of what elements typically occur in what sites. But to summarize, "byssolite" may quite likely have some Fe in it. But we just couldn't give it a more detailed formula because "byssolite" isn't a specific mineral, but just a collector's name for a whole family of furry amphiboles, some of which might have some Fe and some that probably don't.
22nd May 2020 14:01 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
10th Jan 2020 19:29 UTCPaul Brandes 🌟 Manager
10th Jan 2020 21:03 UTCPierre-Luc Croteau
Mindat.org is an outreach project of the Hudson Institute of Mineralogy, a 501(c)(3) not-for-profit organization.
Copyright © mindat.org and the Hudson Institute of Mineralogy 1993-2024, except where stated. Most political location boundaries are © OpenStreetMap contributors. Mindat.org relies on the contributions of thousands of members and supporters. Founded in 2000 by Jolyon Ralph.
Privacy Policy - Terms & Conditions - Contact Us / DMCA issues - Report a bug/vulnerability Current server date and time: April 25, 2024 11:54:48
Copyright © mindat.org and the Hudson Institute of Mineralogy 1993-2024, except where stated. Most political location boundaries are © OpenStreetMap contributors. Mindat.org relies on the contributions of thousands of members and supporters. Founded in 2000 by Jolyon Ralph.
Privacy Policy - Terms & Conditions - Contact Us / DMCA issues - Report a bug/vulnerability Current server date and time: April 25, 2024 11:54:48