rock breakers / trimmers
19th Apr 2013 11:52 UTCJames Jones
JAMES , Pictured here are my 2 trimmers. The first picture is of a small c-clamp trimmer mounted on a wood plank for stability. It was given to me; I would not buy nor recommend one of this type. It will split rock up to about 1" thick. So it is of quite limited use and only for thin or soft, easily split rock. I use it only on easily trimmed rock with non delicate crystals as it can break easily cleaved or delicate crystals, damaging or destroying the specimen.
The second picture is of my larger trimmer. It uses a 6 ton hydraulic jack mounted on a steel stabilizer frame as shown. The blade gap is easily changed with a key that releases jack pressure and is then tightened. The whole set up is about 27" high and 20" wide. The carbon steel blades are quite good, but the drawback with this trimmer is that the blades do not come together. So it will cut rock from 1 1/2" thick to about 6" thick, but not thinner slabs. Sudden fly rock chips are a real possibility so I cover the whole set up with a terry towel as it it gets ready to trim the specimen. The set up was made by a metal fabricating company and it is on loan to me by a collector friend. Hope this helps...................CHEERS.............BOB
The second picture is of my larger trimmer. It uses a 6 ton hydraulic jack mounted on a steel stabilizer frame as shown. The blade gap is easily changed with a key that releases jack pressure and is then tightened. The whole set up is about 27" high and 20" wide. The carbon steel blades are quite good, but the drawback with this trimmer is that the blades do not come together. So it will cut rock from 1 1/2" thick to about 6" thick, but not thinner slabs. Sudden fly rock chips are a real possibility so I cover the whole set up with a terry towel as it it gets ready to trim the specimen. The set up was made by a metal fabricating company and it is on loan to me by a collector friend. Hope this helps...................CHEERS.............BOB
James- I'm sorry, I meant to have inquired prior as to your specimen materials and second half of your tool question? I was already rattled by the potentially timely topic and then Bob's pic, as I had said... I apologize for the pseudo hijack there:)
More importantly- What is the material you are trimming?
You seem to have something in mind. Knowing what you need/want for equipment is good, but the other half of your inquiry, successful processing? Being vague doesn't inspire help.
Surely better direction/assistance will be provided if YOU take time to share the matrix type and potential minerals.
Sed/Ign/Meta matrix? Cobbles, Layered/bedded, or 'massive'? Breccia? Too many variables left open-
As to your sawing: Sounds like you want a trim blade on a hand held angle grinder. STOP- KEEP IN MIND the ROTATION Speed!
Lapidary saw motors are typically ~1725 rpm. The blades can be made thin because of low speed and superior oil COOLING.
An electric handheld grinder is easily in the 10,000 rpm range! High Cetrifugal force and only air cooling make for high heat.
Your trimsaw blade WILL come apart at those speeds and slice deep into you!
I am not being 'dramatic'- it is simple physics and expensively gruesome/traumatic!
DRY Diamond blades are thick for a reason- high speed and heat resistance! The intermittent diamond media is a 'rougher' cut but aids cooling. You can get a continuous rim for wet tile - still a high speed application-so thicker than lapidary.
Be aware that diamond blades are NOT all the same- The diamonds are- but the MEDIA holding them is NOT. Be sure to get a blade suited/rated for the hardness of the material- anything with quartz/chalcedony in it is death for a regular dry blade.
If you are seeing steady bright sparks- STOP- you are killing your blade.
If you need direction/opinion on blade types/applications/source- you need to list what you are driving it with: Tool type or motor and its Make/Model/ rpm.
One further note for success! You said blade for hand held 'cutter'. If you are doing the 'saw trimming' with a hand held grinder- do this!
Put it in a vise with the switch in ON position. Plug the cord into a power strip/switched box right there. Then plug that 'switch' into an extension cord or wherever. The idea is to have the blade stationary, and hold the sample. Bring the sample(with both hands:) to the blade! Gives great control- can be done very reliably- I have cut hundreds of samples for days using that method.
Because-
Rocks are never uniform shapes- to try to clamp them? Pew-there they go! - Power tools always jump at start, and twist while running wears you out (not to mention binding issues??)-and when you stop, you have to wait for blade to quit turning or zing! something...! all BAD for rock sample and you!
On Vise use: Ideal is a 'chain vise'. I use a 3legged portable stand, I have a 7" blade on a 4.5 inch grinder.
Note the power switch box I made for cheap. I prefer this as lightswitch is easier to hit than on a 'power strip.'
You can get just the vise part and screw it to a table/sawhorse/stump etc. (sawhorse should be staked or weighted down.)
It is possible to use a regular jaw vise- just get something to grip the round grinder body more uniformly in flat opposing jaws. Consider how pic applies-vise jaw inserts for round body - can do similar with wood.
Whichever vise you use- DO NOT OVERTIGHTEN- you can easily squish the body and/or bind the spinning internals-all bad:)
Also be mindful of any vents in unit- blocking them can burn up unit.
Wear a halfmask respirator. The 3M disposables with the vent in center are great and last a long while. I prefer my rubber halfmask version w/ replaceable filters- comfy and efficient- worth every penny of my good health- no cut corners-don't be foolish.
Earplugs- oh just do it- Save your hearing-you will miss it!
Gloves- diamond won't cut skin fast like a wood blade(ack-ghastly)leaves an abrasion/burn. BUT- it will take off the harder fingernail instantly- and that IS what pokes out more. Trust me- I know it sux;)
+++++++
Do keep in mind that bit about the more initial detail an info seeker is willing to give, the better the return.
Also please consider adding your country location to your personal info. It helps to know where someone is as to their familiarity and access with products and vendors:)
Hope this info above helps~ I've been planning an article about just such a setup for a while-this is the quickie version.
Good luck in your endeavors- let us know how it comes out~post pics!
~JO:)
More importantly- What is the material you are trimming?
You seem to have something in mind. Knowing what you need/want for equipment is good, but the other half of your inquiry, successful processing? Being vague doesn't inspire help.
Surely better direction/assistance will be provided if YOU take time to share the matrix type and potential minerals.
Sed/Ign/Meta matrix? Cobbles, Layered/bedded, or 'massive'? Breccia? Too many variables left open-
As to your sawing: Sounds like you want a trim blade on a hand held angle grinder. STOP- KEEP IN MIND the ROTATION Speed!
Lapidary saw motors are typically ~1725 rpm. The blades can be made thin because of low speed and superior oil COOLING.
An electric handheld grinder is easily in the 10,000 rpm range! High Cetrifugal force and only air cooling make for high heat.
Your trimsaw blade WILL come apart at those speeds and slice deep into you!
I am not being 'dramatic'- it is simple physics and expensively gruesome/traumatic!
DRY Diamond blades are thick for a reason- high speed and heat resistance! The intermittent diamond media is a 'rougher' cut but aids cooling. You can get a continuous rim for wet tile - still a high speed application-so thicker than lapidary.
Be aware that diamond blades are NOT all the same- The diamonds are- but the MEDIA holding them is NOT. Be sure to get a blade suited/rated for the hardness of the material- anything with quartz/chalcedony in it is death for a regular dry blade.
If you are seeing steady bright sparks- STOP- you are killing your blade.
If you need direction/opinion on blade types/applications/source- you need to list what you are driving it with: Tool type or motor and its Make/Model/ rpm.
One further note for success! You said blade for hand held 'cutter'. If you are doing the 'saw trimming' with a hand held grinder- do this!
Put it in a vise with the switch in ON position. Plug the cord into a power strip/switched box right there. Then plug that 'switch' into an extension cord or wherever. The idea is to have the blade stationary, and hold the sample. Bring the sample(with both hands:) to the blade! Gives great control- can be done very reliably- I have cut hundreds of samples for days using that method.
Because-
Rocks are never uniform shapes- to try to clamp them? Pew-there they go! - Power tools always jump at start, and twist while running wears you out (not to mention binding issues??)-and when you stop, you have to wait for blade to quit turning or zing! something...! all BAD for rock sample and you!
On Vise use: Ideal is a 'chain vise'. I use a 3legged portable stand, I have a 7" blade on a 4.5 inch grinder.
Note the power switch box I made for cheap. I prefer this as lightswitch is easier to hit than on a 'power strip.'
You can get just the vise part and screw it to a table/sawhorse/stump etc. (sawhorse should be staked or weighted down.)
It is possible to use a regular jaw vise- just get something to grip the round grinder body more uniformly in flat opposing jaws. Consider how pic applies-vise jaw inserts for round body - can do similar with wood.
Whichever vise you use- DO NOT OVERTIGHTEN- you can easily squish the body and/or bind the spinning internals-all bad:)
Also be mindful of any vents in unit- blocking them can burn up unit.
Wear a halfmask respirator. The 3M disposables with the vent in center are great and last a long while. I prefer my rubber halfmask version w/ replaceable filters- comfy and efficient- worth every penny of my good health- no cut corners-don't be foolish.
Earplugs- oh just do it- Save your hearing-you will miss it!
Gloves- diamond won't cut skin fast like a wood blade(ack-ghastly)leaves an abrasion/burn. BUT- it will take off the harder fingernail instantly- and that IS what pokes out more. Trust me- I know it sux;)
+++++++
Do keep in mind that bit about the more initial detail an info seeker is willing to give, the better the return.
Also please consider adding your country location to your personal info. It helps to know where someone is as to their familiarity and access with products and vendors:)
Hope this info above helps~ I've been planning an article about just such a setup for a while-this is the quickie version.
Good luck in your endeavors- let us know how it comes out~post pics!
~JO:)
I see there is mention here about Wydar splitters. I am looking into hydraulic specimen trimmers too. Anybody have any clue what the going price on a used Wydar trimer labelled US PATENT 5638805 all painted yellow with a "4x5" should be? Does anybody know much about the trimmer I have pictured here? Is this an old model? Was this made in USA? I keep hearing people saying Wydar was made in China. Anybody know what these went for 15-20 years ago? I'm assuming this may be when this was originally purchased.
