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Fakes & FraudsBlue Halite / Carlsbad NM / real or fake?
17th Aug 2009 22:29 UTCJohn Krygier
This item was identified as Blue Halite from Carlsbad NM. Zoning at several different angles,
and purple rather than blue on one end. The wood cube in the pictures is 1 inch square.
After I bought it I wondered if it could be fake? Can blue halite be faked?
Thanks,
jbk
18th Aug 2009 00:57 UTCKelly Nash 🌟 Expert
18th Aug 2009 02:52 UTCMichael Hopkins
18th Aug 2009 03:12 UTCRichard Dale Expert
5th Sep 2012 21:30 UTCPhilip Simmons
Richard is right on point. The blue and purple color is caused by the radiation effects of K40 decay from surrounding sylvite. I have communicated with Dr. George Rossman on this subject, and am in the process of completing an article that covers this phenomenon in more detail.
I have field collected many of these halite crystals, and they always seem to have sylvite very close by. Many of the pictures seen on Mindat and elsewhere that are labeled "blue halite crystal in clear halite" (or something along those lines) are, in fact, blue halite frozen in colorless SYLVITE. I just collected an interesting piece this past weekend that has crystals of both species growing together, and the only area where the halite is blue is the crystal boundary between the halite and sylvite. The easiest way to differentiate between the two minerals is to taste them...seriously!!! The halite will taste like common salt and the sylvite will have more of a "bite" or bitter taste to it if left on the tongue for a couple seconds.
As for the article, maybe we'll see it sometime in the near future! ;-)
Philip Simmons
Mining Engineer in Carlsbad, NM
21st Sep 2012 00:43 UTCFranklin Roberts
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Gnome
Have you checked to see if your specimens carry any residual radioactivity?
Frank
23rd Sep 2014 13:56 UTCGary Jessey
How can you keep Blue Halite Dry (as well as any other Halite)?
23rd Sep 2014 16:39 UTCRob Woodside 🌟 Manager
23rd Sep 2014 16:41 UTCNelse Miller
11th Oct 2014 18:11 UTCMichael Hatskel
Also, there were no responses to the question asked by Franklin Roberts in his September 20, 2012 post. Does anyone have any input on that?
18th Oct 2014 02:56 UTCRob Woodside 🌟 Manager
18th Oct 2014 04:34 UTCDoug Daniels
18th Oct 2014 10:08 UTCPeter Haas
18th Oct 2014 15:50 UTCSteve Hardinger 🌟 Expert
BTW, the characteristic color produced when an alkali metal (Li, Na, K) is dissolved in liquid ammonia is due to the solvated electron. But other species can produce an identical color, for example, a solution of benzophenone and Na in THF.
/chemistry lesson
18th Oct 2014 17:24 UTCRob Woodside 🌟 Manager
18th Oct 2014 17:42 UTCDoug Daniels
18th Oct 2014 18:39 UTCRob Woodside 🌟 Manager
Years ago at the Science Museum in London they had a display of the periodic table populated with samples of the elements. It was very interesting but I was amused by the apparently empty vials that contained the noble gasses. Currently you can buy Ar filled double windows that for some unknown reason are supposed to have a lower thermal conductivity than air filled windows. Short of inducing electric discharges in the enclosed gas I have no idea how to tell if the Ar is there. I would be surprised if it was.
11th Nov 2014 00:13 UTCErik
Thanks,
Erik
11th Nov 2014 18:33 UTCRock Currier Expert
11th Nov 2014 19:21 UTCPeter Haas
-------------------------------------------------------
> So Peter what then happens to the Na+? Does it
> remain as such (and so the halite lattice begins
> to collect an overall positive charge) or os the
> Na+ reduced to Na?
I don't see your problem. Charge is perfectly balanced, irrespective whether or not the electron gets trapped:
Cl- -> Cl* + e-
Na+ + e- -> Na
There's no guarantee that the electrons get trapped by sodium ions only because there's an electrostatic attraction. Electrons cleaved by photon impact can leave in any direction and with a wide range of kinetic energies. Plus, they are very low mass particles and therefore easily tunnel at a finite chance across electrostatic energy barriers.
By the way, "quasi-free" electrons (i.e. those that are trapped on interstitial positions) are prime examples for the quantum-mechanical "particle-in-a-pot" problem in that their energy states will only depend on the symmetry of the potential energy pot (i.e. the charge distribution in the lattice). Therefore, free electrons in halite always cause a yellowish-green colour, no matter where the electron came from. Likewise, in sylvite, they always cause a purple colour.
11th Nov 2014 20:14 UTCReiner Mielke Expert
12th Nov 2014 00:48 UTCDoug Daniels
19th Nov 2014 01:54 UTCturtledove thrushe
19th Nov 2014 06:10 UTCRock Currier Expert
19th Nov 2014 12:36 UTCWayne Corwin
19th Nov 2014 15:30 UTCturtledove thrushe
-------------------------------------------------------
> Most of the halite from Searles lake is not a pink
> color unless it has been dipped in a bucket of
> brine that has been spiked with a gallon of red
> food die #1.
It seems as if Halite from Searles Lake is either White or Pink sometimes with brine red samples from a quick Google search. I have also seen White hoppered Halite crystals on a pink matrix from Searles as well. Pink Halite is just as common as White Halite from Searles Lake.
Speaking of Searles Lake I would love to go collecting there one day for cabinet Halite pieces along with the Great Salt Lake in Utah.
27th Jan 2015 10:46 UTCUwe Kolitsch Manager
Sylwia M. Zelek, Aleksandra Wesełucha-Birczyńska, Janusz Szklarzewicz, Katarzyna M. Stadnicka (2015): Spectroscopic properties of halite from Kłodawa salt mine, central Poland. Mineral. Petrol. 109, 45-51.
The dynamics of colour centre transformation was investigated in blue halite single crystals from Kłodawa Salt Mine, Central Poland, using UV–vis spectroscopy. The following colour centres were considered: F, R1, R2, as well as plasmons and M centres. The R2 centres predominated in navy blue (A) and pale blue (B) halites. Other relatively large populations were plasmons found in all examined samples. In purple (C) halite samples the plasmon population is the highest one among others and R1 centres appeared to be equally significant, whereas M centres were almost absent. For A and C samples unidentified bands were observed at 26,500 to 26,200 cm−1, respectively. The bleaching process of the blue halites was investigated using temperature dependent UV–vis and micro-Raman spectroscopies. In micro-Raman 300–100 cm−1 region three very intense sharp bands were attributed to the colour centres and colloidal Na precipitation in A and B halites. The one broad band in the range 3,500 to 500 cm−1, which was characteristic even for the colourless sample D but absent in the spectra of colourless NaCl obtained after recrystallization of sample A, requires further study.
27th Jan 2015 15:55 UTCReiner Mielke Expert
28th Jan 2015 23:58 UTCMarek Chorazewicz
I've found pink hoppered crystals and dark pink cubic crystals in a dark red brine pool at the Searles Lake Gem-O-Rama last October. My son was digging 30 meters away in a hard whitish pink crust. He got to a colorless brine underneath the crust and found completely white cubic crystals there. The halite from layers deeper in the lake (from blowhole trip) is colorless as well.
The presentations we saw there stated that the pink color is due to the halobacteria living in brine pools. When the bacteria die from dryness or sun exposure the halite will lose its color.
Best Regards,
MarekC
20th Feb 2015 07:22 UTCRock Currier Expert
6th Sep 2017 22:27 UTCHarley Alton
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Copyright © mindat.org and the Hudson Institute of Mineralogy 1993-2024, except where stated. Most political location boundaries are © OpenStreetMap contributors. Mindat.org relies on the contributions of thousands of members and supporters. Founded in 2000 by Jolyon Ralph.
Privacy Policy - Terms & Conditions - Contact Us / DMCA issues - Report a bug/vulnerability Current server date and time: April 26, 2024 19:29:54