Ramdohrite
A valid IMA mineral species - grandfathered
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About Ramdohrite
Formula:
Pb5.9Fe0.1Mn0.1In0.1Cd0.2Ag2.8Sb10.8S24
Colour:
Grey, bluish black
Lustre:
Metallic
Hardness:
2
Specific Gravity:
5.43
Crystal System:
Monoclinic
Member of:
Name:
Named in honor of Paul Ramdohr (1 January 1890, Überlingen, Germany – 8 March 1985, Hohensachsen/Weinheim, Germany), mineralogist University of Heidelberg, Germany. He researched ore deposits and was a pioneer of ore microscopy. Among numerous medals, he was awarded the Roebling Medal (1962), the Penrose Medal (1972), and the Leonard Medal (1979).
Type locality ramdohrite has a significant Cd component (Moëlo et al., 1989), and is compositionally close to fizelyite, but it is not known if there is a solid solution (a Cd-rich fizelyite ?), or a miscibility gap.
Chemically somewhat comparable to menchettiite, oyonite, uchucchacuaite, lasmanisite and 'dürfeldtite'.
Chemically somewhat comparable to menchettiite, oyonite, uchucchacuaite, lasmanisite and 'dürfeldtite'.
Unique Identifiers
Mindat ID:
3355
Long-form identifier:
mindat:1:1:3355:4
GUID
(UUID V4):
(UUID V4):
34f35055-a28e-4388-bead-993bc1b7dfec
IMA Classification of Ramdohrite
Approved, 'Grandfathered' (first described prior to 1959)
IMA Formula:
Pb5.9Fe0.1Mn0.1In0.1Cd0.2Ag2.8Sb10.8S24
First published:
1930
Classification of Ramdohrite
2.JB.40a
2 : SULFIDES and SULFOSALTS (sulfides, selenides, tellurides; arsenides, antimonides, bismuthides; sulfarsenites, sulfantimonites, sulfbismuthites, etc.)
J : Sulfosalts of PbS archetype
B : Galena derivatives, with Pb
2 : SULFIDES and SULFOSALTS (sulfides, selenides, tellurides; arsenides, antimonides, bismuthides; sulfarsenites, sulfantimonites, sulfbismuthites, etc.)
J : Sulfosalts of PbS archetype
B : Galena derivatives, with Pb
3.4.15.6
3 : SULFOSALTS
4 : ø = 3
3 : SULFOSALTS
4 : ø = 3
5.7.23
5 : Sulphosalts - Sulpharsenites and Sulphobismuthites (those containing Sn, Ge,or V are in Section 6)
7 : Sulpharsenites etc. of Pb and other metals
5 : Sulphosalts - Sulpharsenites and Sulphobismuthites (those containing Sn, Ge,or V are in Section 6)
7 : Sulpharsenites etc. of Pb and other metals
Mineral Symbols
As of 2021 there are now IMA–CNMNC approved mineral symbols (abbreviations) for each mineral species, useful for tables and diagrams.
Please only use the official IMA–CNMNC symbol. Older variants are listed for historical use only.
Please only use the official IMA–CNMNC symbol. Older variants are listed for historical use only.
Symbol | Source | Reference |
---|---|---|
Rdh | IMA–CNMNC | Warr, L.N. (2021). IMA–CNMNC approved mineral symbols. Mineralogical Magazine, 85(3), 291-320. doi:10.1180/mgm.2021.43 |
Rdr | The Canadian Mineralogist (2019) | The Canadian Mineralogist (2019) The Canadian Mineralogist list of symbols for rock- and ore-forming minerals (December 30, 2019). download |
Physical Properties of Ramdohrite
Metallic
Transparency:
Opaque
Colour:
Grey, bluish black
Streak:
Black, grey
Hardness:
2 on Mohs scale
Tenacity:
Brittle
Fracture:
Irregular/Uneven
Density:
5.43 g/cm3 (Measured) 5.543 g/cm3 (Calculated)
Optical Data of Ramdohrite
Anisotropism:
Moderate
Reflectivity:
Wavelength | R1 | R2 |
---|---|---|
400nm | 39.3% | 43.1% |
420nm | 38.8% | 42.8% |
440nm | 38.3% | 42.5% |
460nm | 37.8% | 42.2% |
480nm | 37.4% | 42.0% |
500nm | 36.9% | 41.6% |
520nm | 36.5% | 41.2% |
540nm | 36.0% | 40.9% |
560nm | 35.7% | 40.5% |
580nm | 35.3% | 40.2% |
600nm | 34.8% | 39.7% |
620nm | 34.4% | 39.2% |
640nm | 34.0% | 38.7% |
660nm | 33.4% | 38.0% |
680nm | 32.8% | 37.3% |
700nm | 32.0% | 36.4% |
Graph shows reflectance levels at different wavelengths (in nm). Top of box is 100%. Peak reflectance is 43.1%.
R1 shown in black, R2 shown in red
Colour in reflected light:
White
Pleochroism:
Weak
Comments:
Very weak.
Chemistry of Ramdohrite
Mindat Formula:
Pb5.9Fe0.1Mn0.1In0.1Cd0.2Ag2.8Sb10.8S24
Common Impurities:
Fe,Cd,In
Crystallography of Ramdohrite
Crystal System:
Monoclinic
Class (H-M):
2/m - Prismatic
Cell Parameters:
a = 8.7348(3) Å, b = 13.0543(4) Å, c = 19.3117(6) Å
β = 90.179(2)°
β = 90.179(2)°
Ratio:
a:b:c = 0.669 : 1 : 1.479
Unit Cell V:
2,202.04 ų (Calculated from Unit Cell)
Twinning:
Lamellar on (010).
Comment:
Space group P21/n. Originally given cell: a = 13.09, b = 19.24, c = 8.73 A, beta = 90.3°.
Crystal Structure
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Data courtesy of the American Mineralogist Crystal Structure Database. Click on an AMCSD ID to view structure
ID | Species | Reference | Link | Year | Locality | Pressure (GPa) | Temp (K) |
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
0014713 | Ramdohrite | Makovicky E, Mumme W G (1983) The crystal structure of ramdohrite, Pb6Sb11Ag3S24, and its implications for the andorite group and zinckenite Neues Jahrbuch fur Mineralogie, Abhandlungen 147 58-79 | 1983 | Chocaya Mine, Potosi, Bolivia | 0 | 293 |
CIF Raw Data - click here to close
X-Ray Powder Diffraction
Powder Diffraction Data:
d-spacing | Intensity |
---|---|
3.82 Å | (20) |
3.48 Å | (30) |
3.32 Å | (100) |
3.04 Å | (30) |
2.94 Å | (60) |
2.78 Å | (50) |
2.21 Å | (50) |
Geological Environment
Paragenetic Mode(s):
Paragenetic Mode | Earliest Age (Ga) |
---|---|
High-𝑇 alteration and/or metamorphism | |
33 : Minerals deposited by hydrothermal metal-rich fluids (see also [#12]) |
Type Occurrence of Ramdohrite
General Appearance of Type Material:
Long prismatic to thick lance-shaped reticulating individuals in fine grained quartz.
Place of Conservation of Type Material:
National Museum of Natural History, Washington, D.C., USA (R6595).
Associated Minerals at Type Locality:
Reference:
Ahlfeld, F. (1930) Ramdohrit, ein neues mineral aus Bolivien. Centralblatt für Mineralogie, Geologie und Paläontologie: 8: 365-367.
Other Language Names for Ramdohrite
Varieties of Ramdohrite
Relationship of Ramdohrite to other Species
Member of:
Other Members of this group:
Andreadiniite | CuHgAg7Pb7Sb24S48 | Mon. 2/m : P21/b |
Arsenquatrandorite | Ag17.6Pb12.8Sb38.1As11.5S96 | Mon. 2/m : P21/b |
Aschamalmite | Pb6-3xBi2+xS9 | Mon. 2/m : B2/m |
Clino-oscarkempffite | Ag15Pb6Sb21Bi18S72 | Mon. 2/m : P21/b |
Erzwiesite | Ag8Pb12Bi16S40 | Orth. mmm (2/m 2/m 2/m) : Cmcm |
Eskimoite | Ag7Pb10Bi15S36 | Mon. |
Fizélyite | Ag5Pb14Sb21S48 | Mon. 2/m |
Gustavite | AgPbBi3S6 | Orth. mmm (2/m 2/m 2/m) |
Heyrovskýite | Pb6Bi2S9 | Orth. mmm (2/m 2/m 2/m) : Cccm |
Holubite | Ag3Pb6(Sb8Bi3)S24 | Mon. 2/m |
Jasrouxite | Ag16Pb4(Sb24As16)S72 | Tric. 1 : P1 |
Lasmanisite | Ag12Pb13Mn11Sb44S96 | Orth. 2 2 2 : P21 21 21 |
Lillianite | Pb3-2xAgxBi2+xS6 | Orth. mmm (2/m 2/m 2/m) |
Menchettiite | AgPb2.40Mn1.60Sb3As2S12 | Mon. 2/m : P21/b |
Oscarkempffite | Ag10Pb4(Sb17Bi9)S48 | Orth. mm2 |
Ourayite | Ag3Pb4Bi5S13 | Orth. |
Oyonite | Ag3Mn2Pb4Sb7As4S24 | Mon. 2/m |
Quatrandorite | AgPbSb3S6 | Mon. 2/m : P21/b |
Roshchinite | Ag19Pb10Sb51S96 | Orth. mmm (2/m 2/m 2/m) : Pnma |
Schirmerite | PbAgBi3S6 - Pb3Ag1.5Bi3.5S9 | Orth. |
Senandorite | AgPbSb3S6 | Orth. mm2 : Pmn21 |
Staročeskéite | Ag0.70Pb1.60(Bi1.35Sb1.35)Σ2.70S6 | Orth. mmm (2/m 2/m 2/m) : Cmcm |
Terrywallaceite | AgPb(Sb,Bi)3S6 | Mon. 2/m : P21/b |
Treasurite | Ag7Pb6Bi15S32 | Mon. |
Uchucchacuaite | AgMnPb3Sb5S12 | Orth. mmm (2/m 2/m 2/m) : Pmmm |
Ustarasite | Pb(Bi,Sb)6S10 (?) | |
Vikingite | Ag5Pb8Bi13S30 | Mon. 2/m : B2/m |
Xilingolite | Pb3Bi2S6 | Mon. |
Structurally related to group(s):
Ramdohrite-Lillianite Group | Imprecise and obsolete name. |
Common Associates
Associated Minerals Based on Photo Data:
1 photo of Ramdohrite associated with Pyrite | FeS2 |
1 photo of Ramdohrite associated with Bournonite | PbCuSbS3 |
Related Minerals - Strunz-mindat Grouping
2.JB. | Senandorite | AgPbSb3S6 |
2.JB. | Oscarkempffite | Ag10Pb4(Sb17Bi9)S48 |
2.JB. | Chukotkaite | AgPb7Sb5S15 |
2.JB. | Arsenquatrandorite | Ag17.6Pb12.8Sb38.1As11.5S96 |
2.JB. | Clino-oscarkempffite | Ag15Pb6Sb21Bi18S72 |
2.JB. | Andreadiniite | CuHgAg7Pb7Sb24S48 |
2.JB. | Ginelfite | Ag2(Ag0.5Fe)TlPb23.5(Sb,As)33.5S76 |
2.JB. | Lazerckerite | Ag3.75Pb4.50(Sb7.75Bi4)S24 |
2.JB. | Lasmanisite | Ag12Pb13Mn11Sb44S96 |
2.JB. | Montpelvouxite | AgPb16Sb27As18S84 |
2.JB. | Selenojunoite | Cu2Pb3Bi8Se16 |
2.JB.05 | Diaphorite | Ag3Pb2Sb3S8 |
2.JB.10 | Cosalite | Pb2Bi2S5 |
2.JB.15 | Freieslebenite | AgPbSbS3 |
2.JB.15 | Marrite | AgPbAsS3 |
2.JB.20 | Cannizzarite | Pb48Bi56S132 |
2.JB.20 | Wittite | Pb9Bi12(S,Se)27 |
2.JB.25a | Junoite | Cu2Pb3Bi8(S,Se)16 |
2.JB.25i | Neyite | Ag2Cu6Pb25Bi26S68 |
2.JB.25c | Nordströmite | CuPb3Bi7(Se4S10) |
2.JB.25g | Nuffieldite | Cu1.4Pb2.4Bi2.4Sb0.2S7 |
2.JB.25d | Proudite | CuPb7.5Bi9.33(S,Se)22 |
2.JB.25h | Weibullite | Pb5Bi8Se7S11 |
2.JB.25b | Felbertalite | Cu2Pb6Bi8S19 |
2.JB.25j | Rouxelite | Cu2HgPb23Sb27S65.5 |
2.JB.25f | Ángelaite | Cu2AgPbBiS4 |
2.JB.25i | Cuproneyite | Cu7Pb27Bi25S68 |
2.JB.30a | Geocronite | Pb14Sb6S23 |
2.JB.30a | Jordanite | Pb14As6S23 |
2.JB.30b | Kirkiite | Pb10Bi3As3S19 |
2.JB.30c | Tsugaruite | Pb28As15S50Cl |
2.JB.30a | Marcobaldiite | Pb12(Sb3As2Bi)Σ6S21 |
2.JB.30a | Arsenmarcobaldiite | Pb12(As3.2Sb2.8)Σ6S21 |
2.JB.35c | Pillaite | Pb9Sb10S23ClO0.5 |
2.JB.35a | Zinkenite | Pb9Sb22S42 |
2.JB.35b | Scainiite | Pb14Sb30S54O5 |
2.JB.35d | Pellouxite | (Cu,Ag)Pb10Sb12S27O(Cl,S)0.6 |
2.JB.35f | Tubulite | Ag2Pb22Sb20S53 |
2.JB.35e | Chovanite | Pb15-2xSb14+2xS36Ox (x ~ 0.2) |
2.JB.40b | Aschamalmite | Pb6-3xBi2+xS9 |
2.JB.40a | Bursaite | Pb5Bi4S11 (?) |
2.JB.40b | Eskimoite | Ag7Pb10Bi15S36 |
2.JB.40a | Fizélyite | Ag5Pb14Sb21S48 |
2.JB.40a | Gustavite | AgPbBi3S6 |
2.JB.40a | Lillianite | Pb3-2xAgxBi2+xS6 |
2.JB.40c | Ourayite | Ag3Pb4Bi5S13 |
2.JB.40a | Roshchinite | Ag19Pb10Sb51S96 |
2.JB.40d | Schirmerite | PbAgBi3S6 - Pb3Ag1.5Bi3.5S9 |
2.JB.40a | Treasurite | Ag7Pb6Bi15S32 |
2.JB.40a | Uchucchacuaite | AgMnPb3Sb5S12 |
2.JB.40e | Ustarasite | Pb(Bi,Sb)6S10 (?) |
2.JB.40a | Vikingite | Ag5Pb8Bi13S30 |
2.JB.40a | Xilingolite | Pb3Bi2S6 |
2.JB.40b | Heyrovskýite | Pb6Bi2S9 |
2.JB.40 | UM1988-05-S:AgBiCuHgPb | (Hg,Ag,Cu,Pb)5Pb5Bi11S27 |
2.JB.40 | UM1988-06-S:AgBiCuHgPb | (Pb,Hg)12(Cu,Ag)3(Bi,Sb)10(S,Te)27 |
2.JB.40a | Quatrandorite | AgPbSb3S6 |
2.JB.40a | Menchettiite | AgPb2.40Mn1.60Sb3As2S12 |
2.JB.40a | Terrywallaceite | AgPb(Sb,Bi)3S6 |
2.JB.40a | Jasrouxite | Ag16Pb4(Sb24As16)S72 |
2.JB.40a | Erzwiesite | Ag8Pb12Bi16S40 |
2.JB.40a | Staročeskéite | Ag0.70Pb1.60(Bi1.35Sb1.35)Σ2.70S6 |
2.JB.40a | Oyonite | Ag3Mn2Pb4Sb7As4S24 |
2.JB.40a | Holubite | Ag3Pb6(Sb8Bi3)S24 |
2.JB.40b | Baiamareite | Ag4Pb12Fe4Sb20S48 |
2.JB.55 | Gratonite | Pb9As4S15 |
2.JB.60 | Marrucciite | Hg3Pb16Sb18S46 |
2.JB.65 | Vurroite | Pb20Sn2(Bi,As)22S54Cl6 |
2.JB.65 | Tazieffite | Pb20Cd2(As,Bi)22S50Cl10 |
2.JB.70 | Daliranite | PbHgAs2S5 |
Other Information
Health Risks:
No information on health risks for this material has been entered into the database. You should always treat mineral specimens with care.
Internet Links for Ramdohrite
mindat.org URL:
https://www.mindat.org/min-3355.html
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References for Ramdohrite
Reference List:
Fleischer, Michael, Cabri, Louis J., Nickel, Ernest H., Pabst, Adolf (1977) New Mineral Names. American Mineralogist, 62 (5-6) 593-600
Dunn, Pete J., Chao, George Y., Fleischer, Michael, Ferraiolo, James A., Langley, Richard H., Pabst, Adolf, Zilczer, Janet A. (1985) New mineral names. American Mineralogist, 70 (1-2) 214-221
Jambor, John L., Burke, Ernst A. J. (1991) New Mineral Names. American Mineralogist, 76 (11-12) 2020-2026
Moëlo, Yves, Makovicky, Emil, Mozgova, Nadejda N., Jambor, John L., Cook, Nigel, Pring, Allan, Paar, Werner, Nickel, Ernest H., Graeser, Stephan, Karup-Møller, Sven, Balic-unic, Tonči, Mumme, William G., Vurro, Filippo, Topa, Dan (2008) Sulfosalt systematics: a review. Report of the sulfosalt sub-committee of the IMA Commission on Ore Mineralogy. European Journal of Mineralogy, 20 (1) 7-62 doi:10.1127/0935-1221/2008/0020-1778
Yang, H., Downs, R. T., Burt, J. B., Costin, G. (2009) Structure refinement of an untwinned single crystal of Ag-excess fizélyite, Ag5.94Pb13.74Sb20.84S48,. The Canadian Mineralogist, 47 (5) 1257-1264 doi:10.3749/canmin.47.5.1257
Localities for Ramdohrite
Locality List
- This locality has map coordinates listed.
- This locality has estimated coordinates.
ⓘ - Click for references and further information on this occurrence.
? - Indicates mineral may be doubtful at this locality.
- Good crystals or important locality for species.
- World class for species or very significant.
(TL) - Type Locality for a valid mineral species.
(FRL) - First Recorded Locality for everything else (eg varieties).
Struck out - Mineral was erroneously reported from this locality.
Faded * - Never found at this locality but inferred to have existed at some point in the past (e.g. from pseudomorphs).
All localities listed without proper references should be considered as questionable.
All localities listed without proper references should be considered as questionable.
Argentina | |
| DE BRODTKORB +1 other reference |
| Paar et al. (2000) |
Bolivia | |
| Keutsch et al. (2007) +1 other reference |
| Torres et al. (2019) |
| Kempff et al. (La Paz, 2009) |
| Knut Eldjarn Collection +1 other reference |
| The Mineralogical Record: 32: 461. +2 other references |
collections of Alfredo Petrov & ... +1 other reference | |
Wilson (2001) | |
Federico Ahlfeld y Alejandro Schneider-Scherbina (1964) | |
Bulgaria | |
| Strashimirov et al. (2005) |
Strashimirov et al. (2005) | |
China | |
| Mineral Deposits 4 (1) |
| Anthony |
| Bosheng Zhou et al. (2002) |
| Dong Zhensheng et al. (1996) |
| Xiaoming Qu et al. (2001) |
| Gui He and Xipeng Hu (2009) |
| Xinpei Jiang (1994) +1 other reference |
Finland | |
| Geological Survey of Finland ... |
France | |
| Moëlo et al. (1989) |
| Wittern (1997) |
| Moëlo et al. (1989) |
Greece | |
| Voudouris et al. (2008) |
India | |
| Holler et al. (1995) |
Japan | |
| AMNH specimen |
Mexico | |
| Camprubi |
North Macedonia | |
| Boev et al. (1993) |
Norway | |
| Nigel J. Cook |
Cook (2001) | |
Peru | |
| Olivo et al. (2003) |
Romania | |
| Papp et al. (2007) |
Russia | |
| A. A. Kalinin et al. (2016) |
| Jambor et al. (1994) |
| Gamyanin et al. (1998) +1 other reference |
| Kasatkin et al. (2020) |
Slovakia | |
| Bálintová T. et al. (Slovakia) |
| Martin Števko-unpublished |
| Duda et. all. |
specialities of chemical composition. ... +1 other reference | |
Spain | |
| Rewitzer et al. (part2) |
USA | |
| Van Nostrand Reinholt Press: 139 +2 other references |
| Quigley +1 other reference |
| ... |
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Ánimas Mine, Chocaya-Animas mining district, Atocha Municipality, Sud Chichas Province, Potosí, Bolivia